The search for Number 50

[xann]

Its a fairly long read, and prolly not a sudject that any of you will be that intrested in, but it you are bored or have some spare time read this...

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=091216/JimmyRobinson

Its a story written by Wright Thompson, detailing his experiences in looking for a man that fought Muhammad Ali that has virtually disappeared.

[Brigh]

Thanks Xan - Very interesting read, I can't believe all the things that have happened to the other guys who fought Ali

Brigh

[Saxif]

I haven'r read the story yet but I do know something about Muhamid Ali and what I know makes me dislike the guy.  I really think he was a retard and a patsy for some fairly hard-core religous bigots, he was used and was no where near as good as he claimed.  Basically he was full of shit and doesn't deserve all the respect given to him ...

Sax.

[xann]

I haven'r read the story yet but I do know something about Muhamid Ali and what I know makes me dislike the guy.  I really think he was a retard and a patsy for some fairly hard-core religous bigots, he was used and was no where near as good as he claimed.  Basically he was full of shit and doesn't deserve all the respect given to him ...

Sax.

IMO he was more abused than "used", the Nation of Islam hijacked his popularity and used his naiveness against him. I'm not saying he was unintelligent, but he had no education, he couldn't read or write, knew little of the world, and being black in the 60's Malcom X was someone he must of looked upto, he was in the NoI at the time, then Elijah Muhammad changed his name, and in one fell swoop they had this superstar as a figure head for their rallies etc

He was always "outspoken" he was called the louisville lip way before he touched religion, he'd always let his mouth run no matter what he was talking about. What he said about race and intergration, "White Devils" "No black man or woman should let White children mix with theirs", yet he was often seen with White friends and was close with his white trainer Angelo Dundee.

Alot of people hated him, for becoming a muslim, for not going to vietnam, he was arrogant, had no humility, so it is intresting how some1 with those attributes was/became so respected... what overshadowed it was his biggest attribute, he had charisma. Just watch his interviews, the shit he would say is just wrong, but the way he speaks and his poetical quotes made him popular.

Theres lots to say about him, but i'll just say he was some1 who got taken in by the wrong crowd, was that his fault? considering his skin colour, closeted childhood, the country he was in and the year it was...

Also it is very true that alot of people respected and idolised him more after he got Parkinsons.

In the end, what he should be remebered for is the Boxing skills, and he had the best chin in heavywieght history, the man couldn't be stopped.

Anyway, the stories not got anything to do with him really, its all about the search for Sweet Jimmy

[Saxif]

His arrogance wasn't an appelaing trait and how can you respect someone who allows others to manipulate him.  I dunno about the chin and unstoppability, the fights with Fraiser where close and from what I know a litle dodgy, it is only a shame Fraiser had a dodgy eye, if he could see properly he'd prolly have stopped him.

Sax.

[xann]

Decisions are dodgy, once the're in the ring its up to them(most of the time). Joe HATED Ali, still does, imo prolly wanted to kill him, no one else could take flush left hooks from him, ali did. Then Joe got brutalized by big george foreman, ali took foremans best shots and was still there. I think most boxing "historians" believe ali had one of the best chins. It was prolly his arrogance that stopped him from going to sleep. Joe was partialy blind for most of his career, still hit people fine.

His arrogance wasn't an appelaing trait

ofc, and what makes it worse is that it was real(imo) not boxing trash talk

how can you respect someone who allows others to manipulate him.

Pretty sure this was more rhetorical than aimed at me, but personaly i respect what he was in the ring, not what he did outside...

Although, who "allows" themselves to be manipulated? not every1 is "smart" enough to see thru people and their real motives, should they be disliked and disrespected by default?

[Saxif]

Although, who "allows" themselves to be manipulated? not every1 is "smart" enough to see thru people and their real motives, should they be disliked and disrespected by default?

I agree but I still don't like him.  The main reason is his arrogance and the way he went after Joe Fraiser, I watched a programme which admittedly was aimed at bigging up Fraiser but what I saw on their of Ali wasn't a good look.  The programme revolved around the 3? fights they had, was very interesting.

Sax.